Thursday, August 04, 2005

“Well, If We Do It…”

Here’s an interesting comparison to make.

For months, the Bush Administration has been hammering away with the allegation (could be true, could be false, I still haven’t seen the documentation) that Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez is funneling financial support to MAS and Evo Morales. The charge was most recently repeated by US Undersecretary of State for Latin America Affairs, Roger Noriega in July when he said, "It's no secret that Evo Morales reports to Caracas and Havana." Here’s a news clip.
The assertion here, of course, is that there is something sinister with the government of one country overtly meddling in the democratic political process of another – a concern that is certainly valid.

The flip side, however, is that the US quite overtly, through the National Endowment for Democracy, funneled at least $31,000 to organizers of the unsuccessful anti-Chavez referendum in Venezuela. This is not new for the NED, which has a long track record of funneling funds to opposition groups taking on governments the US doesn’t care for.

Today Senator John McCain called on Chavez to end the government’s prosecution of the group that received the NED funds. A Venezuelan judge has charged four leaders of the group with conspiracy for using foreign funds to help finance the referendum. Here's the article.

Perhaps it is naive to think that there ought to be some consistency here, but if the US overtly tries to topple a democratically elected government by helping finance a referendum (and it would be more naive to assume that that is ALL the US has done and is doing to topple Chavez) then by what justification does the US proclaim it would be an outrage if Chavez was funneling money to MAS?

It looks a lot like the US government is applying a principle that has become far too familiar of late: “If we do it is it okay. If you do it, it’s an attack on democracy.”

10 Comments:

Anonymous japaza said...

For newbies to this blog, go here first:

http://www.publiushpundits.com/?p=1308

and/or here

http://bolicarreras.blogspot.com/2005/07/
ngos-shenanigans-what-is-behind-bolivia_06.html

6:35 PM  
Blogger Juanson said...

31k is chump change. Plus, funding Sumate is like funding a get out the vote drive. While worse in the 70s, NED is pretty clean these days.

1:24 AM  
Anonymous eduardo said...

Sure, if Chavez was financing GOTV drives or even campaigns of lesser municipal candidates, it wouldn't be so bad.

However, I have a feeling that (if indeed there is proven evidence) Chavez' money goes to fund blockades, mobilizations and other rights-stomping activities that really hurt the same people he claims to represent. Where does the money come from that pays the per diems for the marchers who travel 3-4 days to La Paz? I doubt that all of it is funded by contributions from the MAS Congressmen and their relatively high salaries.

7:43 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

31k is chump change
so what would the limit be, something like 50k maybe? Whats the going rate for subverting democracy? Thats a pretty inane observation, Christian.

and if you check their own website, the NED was established in 1983. Before that, the CIA and other spookish thugs took care of this kind of thing. What happened was that after the bad rap from Iran-Contra among other 'incidents', Reagan decided to switch tactics a little, creating an independent (read unaccountable) new agency with a name so sardonic it would make Goebbels weep.

For more about NED's "hygiene", go here:
http://www.thirdworldtraveler.com/Blum/TrojanHorse_RS.html

4:01 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

As far as the racist "conventional knowledge" that the marchers must be funded by outside sources, since they don't have the means to organize and support themselves, well, thats all it is: racism.

Who paid for Gandhi's procession to the Indian Ocean? Who paid the Argentinian caceroleros? The Ecuadorian forajidos?

4:10 PM  
Anonymous eduardo said...

Why is that racist to suggest that someone is funding the mobilizations? I tend to believe that the Santa Cruz cabildo was financed by the oil companies. Is that racist too?

11:43 PM  
Blogger Darrell said...

I was watching Joseph Campbell last night. "Transformations of Myth Trough Time" was the name of this lecture series.

Campbell tells a story of attending a seminar given by a highly respected Rabbi. Campbell asked the question how do you know the difference between a devine sacrifice and a murderous one. The Rabbi had just finished excoriating the Phoenicians for killing the eldest sons in some such instances, and praising to the heavens Aron for coming a second away from killing his eldest son before God said stop. This is an Old Testament Bible story.

The Rabbi simply responded: "We were told by God to do this." Using the word 'We' is saying his people, the Jews, are God's "Chosen People." They can and must do whatever God says. This continues to be the belief today.

With the Judeo-Christian religion Americans have inherited this same God. I think Americans and their government believe they are the "Chosen People." Just one notch below the Jews. The Jews are the spiritual "Chosen People." The Americans are the political "Chosen People." Democracy is the Cross held up to people around the world to show them the devine greatness of America. That's why you all better become democracies. That's why America can do things that other countries can't: torture, invasion, occupation, build Atomic bombs, and interfere in other people's elections.

4:12 PM  
Blogger Boli-Nica said...


Perhaps it is naive to think that there ought to be some consistency here, but if the US overtly tries to topple a democratically elected government by helping finance a referendum (and it would be more naive to assume that that is ALL the US has done and is doing to topple Chavez) then by what justification does the US proclaim it would be an outrage if Chavez was funneling money to MAS?



Nice spin Jim.

If A is wrong, but B is doing the same thing, then A is right.

When some random miner in the street demonstrations is caught with $5,000.00 bucks in cash, you know there is some big-time backing.

Whether it is Chavez or "Chapare" friends, who knows, but it sure isn't coming from Bolivia's poor.

If it is Chavez throwing his money around to MAS - as his ambassador in Argentina was reputed to have done, it certainly is more than 30 grand the NED gave the opposition.

2:09 PM  
Anonymous Javier F. said...

mmm...if USA does it, is ok...if Chavez does it, is not.

I did not get the message like this from Noriega.

I got it: We the US don't like Chavez. We the US finance against Chavez (NED)…and there are public records that prove this. Chavez in the other hand, does not have any public record of financing MAS, nor did I hear any statement from Chavez saying so.

But does Chavez finance Evo? Since there is not hard proof for us the people…I can only say…YES, I GUESS Chavez finance Evo.

Jim, you said:
Roger Noriega in July …said, "It's no secret that Evo Morales reports to Caracas and Havana."

It is not a secret means…we are outrage that Evo reports to Caracas??

Jim, you are saying, if US tries to get rid of Chavez by helping finance his end to the presidency, then, US should not be OUTRAGE to claim knowing Chavez finance MAS.

I don’t think the US is OUTRAGE. We all know US does not like Chavez…and it is very public about it. Jim you found about NED, and I am sure there are plenty of publications out there that say…we the US don’t like Chavez….here…another justification, Chavez finance Evo, a known politician against US interests.

But, does Chavez say?…I help MAS, I finance EVO. If this is right or wrong is another debate. The thing is, if the US did not mentioned, most of us would not presume Chavez helps Evo.

All I want, and I imagine the people, is to know who finances who…then, we can make our own conclusions. Of course, we all know, we the people are the last ones to know what is going on.

Pardon the generalization…when I say US…I mean the current US administration…the ones that make policy about this subjects.

Saludos, Javier

3:23 PM  
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